joezero

I'm wanting to shave my door handles before I got it painted, and anyways I was just thinking that it seems like it would probably cost as much (if not more) to have it done that it would just to buy a welding kit and do it myself. The only thing is, I've never welded before, so is this something that after some practice I could do? If not, how much would I be looking at to have a shop do it? If so, what sort of welding kit should I be looking to buy? Thanks, Joe

1986CamaroSC

I'm just curious but how would you open the door without door handles??

joezero

with door poppers, although someone else (i'm not sure who it was) used the door lock actuators, which is much cheaper. Anyway you just attach it to the cable that the door handle goes to that opens the latch, then you trigger the solenoid or actuator with a remote. It pulls on the cable and opens the door. Since there's no outside handle, you don't have to lock the door.

1986CamaroSC

sounds pretty swwet, but what do thirdgens look like with shaved door handles.

joezero

They look pretty damn good without em. Although think about it this way. Think about how crappy the stock door handles look, and how it'd be nice to get rid of em.

sheet outta luck

heres a photochop job i did a while back (not a good one)
it'll show you the difference

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

This is what it looks like without door handles or locks:

(BTW, if you don't like the car, think its rice, whatever...spare us all and just PM me! I'm sick of a few a-holes ruining good threads here!)

devianb

I have been wondering about shaved door handles too. Do the solenoids operate well in freezing temperatures?

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

To answer your questions, its not that hard to do. I would practice on some thin, automotive grade sheetmetal before you start welding on your car, though. The metal is thin, and very easy to warp if you don't know what you're doing. Shannon (Redraif, the car's owner and my gf) installed and wired the door poppers herself, before I knew her ,so you can PM her with any specific questions about that part. We started by removing the handles and lock cylinders, and making posterboard patterns for the filler pieces. Make them as close as possible, so that when you duplicate the patterns with sheetmetal (we used a crunched door from a bodyshop scrap pile) there is very little gap. The smaller the gap, the less weld it will take, the less chance of warping the metal. Set your welder (MIG) on its lowest heat setting, and turn the wire speed low also..you may have to play with it a little. Tack weld the pieces in, skipping from one side to the other so as not to build up too much heat. Once the pieces are welded solid, dress the welds with a body grinder. If you did a good job, very little filler will be required. I would use a product like All Metal, or Marglass...they have greater strength than regular plastic fillers. Finish with epoxy primer and a skim coat of regular body filler if necessary. If you don't have access to paint equipment, spray over the area with paint to seal it until you have the door (or whole car) painted. Regular spray can primers won't seal out rust.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Since they're in the door jamb, I doubt that it would be a problem...no more than your starter solenoid. Of course, it rarely gets colder than the 20s here in GA, and even then for only short times.

SATURN5

A buddy charges around 350 to shave the locks and handles and have it ready to paint. (eg smoothed, primed) There are 2 ways to go about shaving the handles. You can either cut out the entire pocket and flange the hole and cut a fill plate or you can leave the pocket and cut a fill plate a touch smaller than the pocket (eg flush) and MIG weld the plate in by welding small sections at a time (eg tack weld all the way around then weld in 1 inch at a time til closed, let cool between each weld otherwise the heat will warp the door skin.) Grind the welds smooth, fill, prime and paint. To acuate the latch I use door lock soleniods triggered by either a button, remote or magnetic contact switch. cheers, Bob

redbird_400

That looks like Rice to me.

cobrakiller1989

iTrader: (1)

if you drag race your car, keep in mind that most tracks that are hard at techin you in are not gonna let you race without door handles..

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

True...if you go to NHRA tracks a lot, you may not want to do this. maybe udpate to a newer/better looking door handle instead.

devianb

Redbird_400, can you please use some other term other rice. That word usually starts flames and often gets important threads closed. I hate it when I have to start a new thread to have a question answered becuase a few people started flamming and got my thread closed. I was thinking the same thing you were, but I just kept it to myself. Not trying to sound like an a-hole here.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Just because a car is shaved doesn't make it ****...you guys need to realize that most of these mods, whether you like them or not, didn't come from the import crowd! Shaving started in the 40s and 50s with customs, cars like 49 Mercuries amd stuff like that. Believe it or not, the car hobby didn't start with the F-body, or the ricers...none of this stuff is new!!!

I guess James Dean, George Barris, etc were the first "ricers"

SATURN5

Rice belongs on your plate, not on your ride..

Mathius

I've seen handle shaving make a car look good or bad (this is just my opinion mind you!). The photoshopped picture, I don't really care for on that particular car. Of course he also lowered it and put enormous rims on it that I don't really care for, so that may have something to do with it.

Redraif's car looks good without them, and Steve Scauffel's (I apologize if I butchered the spelling!) car also comes to mind, where he smoothed just about everything on his car.

Another door handle mod that I haven't seen done a whole lot, that I think looks _really_ awesome, is the one where you change the stock hinge out with one of those newer hinges that has a whole interior plate. That's the best way I can describe it, here's the only picture I happen to have of the finished job. If anyone knows a vehicle with this type of handle, please voice it. Off the top of my head, I _think_ the Ford escorts have these, but I'm not sure.

Mathius

deadbird

I'm not sure but, I believe I've seen that pic somewhere along with a new progress picture like this one



Allso..I'm not positive but, I think I saw somewhere where the guy said they (the handles) are off a dodge intrepid

(that's my car bud & I'm just messin with ya with the crap I said above )

joezero

My only real concern is that after less than a month of experience, would I be able to do this without running a good risk or warping the metal. As for whether or not it's "rice", I could care less. I bet if any of you saw my car, you'd think it was rice already. But where I live, everybody (well, everbody but me it seems) has a ton of money to blow and so they're either building (well having built actually, nobody around here knows about cars either) rice rockets, or else they're getting late model z-28s, SS, trans-ams, etc. When people ask what kind of car I have and I say camaro, they get all excited and ask what year. "'88" "oh, o.k." So I've gotta do something interesting to my car (like shave the door handles) to make my car stand out around here. That's more important to me, because no matter what there will always be somebody faster. (My neighbor around the corner has a 68 cobra. You wanna talk about fast ) So I figure I might as well look good and enjoy my car, rather than trying to brag about my engine. If I really wanted to do that, I'd sure as hell not get a 350. Really, all I want to know, is what equipement I'd need (like weld kit, and somebody'd mentioned something about a grinder, what kind) and if it is feasible to do with little to no experience. And for those of you that want to mock the idea, go right ahead. The way I see it, I'm only 19, I'm still young and shallow.

Ward

iTrader: (1)

I like shaved door handles but I am too afraid to put them on my car for one reason. Scenario: you leave for work, get there, and you're in a hurry, so you accidentally leave your lights on. A few hours later you come out and you're battery is dead. How the crap are you gonna even pop your hood to get a jump? Lol I have have always wondered if this has happened to anyone with electric door pops.

Also, the red firebird pictured above (redraif's car) would look soooo much better IMO with 1.)the spoilers removed from under the front and back bumpers, or 2.) the aforementioned spoilers molded to the body on either side, I.E. it "keeps going" into the bumper. Not trying to flame or diss your car, but thats just what I would have done.

Deadbird: Are the rods for your door lock/latch connected to those new handles? That is looking pretty freeking sweet dude.

joezero

I suppose you could always crawl in through the back hatch, although that wouldn't be fun. I look at it like this: possiblity of having to crawl over back seat to get into car vs. being able to have a smooth profile and have your doors open at the push of a button.

sheet outta luck

if it had stickers, 5 spoilers, and typeR badges.........then yes.
but its more along the lines of "tacky", "cheesy", "crap", etc.

thats my opinion

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

There are a couple things you can do...either run remote jumper terminals (like on drag cars) and hide them somewhere, or just crawl through the hatch. Its a little inconvenient, but not that big a deal. You may want to wire in an emergency button for use if the battery in your remote dies (more likely).

No problem...neither of us expect everyone to like every mod on the car, or even like it at all...but its her car, done her way, and she's happy with it. Thanks for being tactful, and not insulting. I agree with you that they would look better molded to the car, but there's a problem with that...one, assembly becomes nearly inpossible (it was hard enough getting it all together without scratching or cracking the paint), since the bumper cover,ground effect and spoiler would have to be one piece. The other problem is that there is no good way to bond dissimilar materials like urethane and fiberglass...if the ground effects were fiberglass, it wouldn't be hard. We just didn't want to have filler cracking and breaking off three months down the road. Believe it or not, the spoilers do flow a lot better in person. Besides, we are soon going to be building a custom nose, and maybe a custom rear as well, that would integrate the look of the modifed rear spoilers. In that case, it will be fiberglass, and there will be enough changes that the origin of these pieces will be less obvious. The whole reason for them in the first place was that there are no aftermarket ground effects for these cars that look modern enough. I at one time thought the car would look better without them, but having seen it that way it looks naked...its not for everybody, but they fit the style of the car very well IMHO.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

If you practice, you could have MIG welding down well enough in a month. Its pretty easy as far as welding goes. A decent welder will cost you at least $400, a grinder $50-75, and tin snips about $10. You might be able to rent a welder if you don't plan on using it a lot.

Its a good thing you could care less about someone calling it ****...on this board, anything that deviates from the stock look is "****". Body mod? ****. Wheels other than the overdone GTA, Torque Thrust II, Firehawk, SS, ROHs...basically any wheel you can't order out of GMHTP Magazine...****. Any use of color except on the body...****. Anything that suddenly makes the loudmouthed critics' cars look even more dated, played, and boring in comparison...****. So don't worry about it...build you car the way you want, and let the a-holes be a-holes. It never fails.

joezero

I've seen ones for $200 that were the two gas and arc welders for as low as $100. (Sorry I keep getting confused which one is MIG and which one is TIG) Are these gonna pretty much be total crap? The only stuff I'd ever really use it for would be for bodywork, exhaust, and maybe if I had to custom fab a bracket or something. I was hoping that I might be able to save on the cost a little bit by doing it myself and getting some good tools/experience in the process. But if I'm gonna need ~$500 in equipment, I may just have a shop do it. If I could do it with a cheaper welder, then I'll probably go at it myself. Thanks, Joe

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Mig (which has a wire feed, not a stick type) is what you want. You might be able to find a less expensive model through Home Depot, Northern, Harbor Freight...but still, you're looking at near $300 for a basic model. The tools will cost you a little more than having a shop do it, but at least when you finish you'll still have the tools.

redbird_400

No your wrong. It looks like rice.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

A car with shaved handles and oversized wheels/tires is **** now?

joezero

I was also thinking that maybe I would do better to buy a used one. What sort of specification should I be looking for? Oh, and LT1 guy, don't waste your effort with guys like redbird. The way I see it there's really only two ways people see a cars appearence on this board. Classic styling which has now become known as ******* to all but those who drive those cars or rice. It's really not worth it to try and change peoples minds. I figure I'll do what I like and if people like it, then we have something in common. If they don't I respect their difference of opinon and can only hope they respect mine.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

For your intended uses, virtually any MIG will work...a used one may be a good option. I would stick with a reputable brand like Miller or Lincoln...there are others but the brand names escape me. The Advetiser here in Atlanta always has tons of good used shop equipment, so maybe you could find one in a publication like that.

You're probably right, the narrowminded on this board will never accept anything other than their view of what is appropriate for these cars. Like you, I don't expect everyone to like what I like...if we( my girlfriend and I) were looking for acceptance, we wouldn't be driving F-bodies, esp not third gens. I could understand if these cars were anything special straight from the factory, but for the most part they weren't. They were slow even by 80s standards (Turbo Buicks, Mustangs, Vettes, old musclecars, even 2.2 liter FWD Omni GLHs and stuff like that would walk ALL OVER them...I was there, I saw it!), they squeaked, rattled, and had only tape stripes, fake scoops, and borrowed "performance image" from the previous generations. Unless they're a 1LE, Turbo TA, or Firehawk, they're virtually worthless in stock form, so why go to great efforts to make them look stock? Its not like an LO3 305 is some street racer's dream engine, whether its "not stock" or not...the sleeper game is only fun when you're really fast. Otherwise, it just screams "I don't have the money/imagination/skill to improve the looks of my car". The 3rd gens only have two things going for them, other than cost...they have a good chassis that easily accepts any V* Chevy engine you want to put in there, and an aftermarket that makes it all easy. Its funny, the main enemy of third gen guys used to be 5.0 Mustangs...I guess losing to them got old, so they started attacking import guys who really don't care about speed.

redbird_400

No I just dont like the rims and the lowering job. doesnt look right

redbird_400

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joezero

I didn't know craftsman made welders, but I found one on ebay. Does anybody know if these are any good, cause I work at sears so the sales person would probably give me a really good deal.

Marc 85Z28

iTrader: (3)

Everyone else is always "narrowminded" when you're the odd one . I usually won't comment on what other people like on their car, but your's is definately unique. But the outrageous stuff I have to chime in. You HONESTLY think that car looks decent? Your car is not rice, it's just in plain bad taste. Ugly is ugly, and I know it when I see it. Ya know, it wouldn't look too bad with some different wheels... those $59 Pep Boys specials just don't cut it

redbird_400

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Check it out! Its where you need to go!

si_camaro

Surely this means that you'd have to press your remote button again after you've opened the door? Otherwise the door lock actuator would be holding the latch open, thus preventing it from holding the door closed.

I mean correct me if I'm wrong about that, but it seems logical that if the door lock stays unlocked when you hit the button, then the door latch would too.

As a (boring) safety note, that would also mean that in the event of a bad accident, you'd have to fumble around for a button inside the car in order to escape. I think I'd go with the more expensive route of having a seperate actuator for the latch, it'd save a lot of hassle in the long run.

Just my 10 cents, my 2 cents is free (copyright (c) eminem 2002 allrightsreservedfailuretocomplywithcopyrightlawmayresultincriminalprosecution)

joezero

I think that the door lock acutators only exert pull when they're given a signal, and otherwise are in a neutral position. And you use a seperate set of for the door poppers than you do for power locks (if your car is so equipped). Even if it doesn't go back to a neutral position, you could just wire it so that once the doors open it would reset itself. Bob could probably answer that better though (I think he's the one that used 'em).

si_camaro

Bob's must be different to the ones I fitted then. Mine work essentially as an electric version of the standard door lock rods, in that they move out and stay when the button is pressed, and then move in and stay when it is pressed again. When you press the button you hear a single "clump" of the door locking/unlocking...and now that I think about it, my dad's Caprice has central locking from the factory and, when locked or unlocked, there is a "clump" followed by a second, quieter "clump" when you release the button.

I still stand by the safety issue though, unless there is a way of keeping the door handle operational as well as the button.

joezero

I would think that you could somehow wire it so that when the doors opened and the courtesy lights came on that it would automatically reverse the actuator.

FyreLance

lmao Redbird, the buttons are funny.

Is there ever going to be a day when everyone on this board stops biting everyone else's head off when they don't like something?

I keep hearing "I don't usually comment on this, but... ::flame flame flame:: " and the like. Nobody has any tact any more.

I'm friggin' not even 19 years old and I know how to respect other people's cars, whether I'd do it to my own car or not. I'm thinking that even some (emphasis on some) of you older car guys (all due respect) can be ****** about this. I'm sorry, I'm typically very respectful of my elders, but it's ridiculous. And, as for the younger crowd... well, hey. What can I say. Boys will be boys. I have no excuse to give for my generation.

READ: GOOD THREADS GET LOCKED BECAUSE OF THE IMMATURITY OF A FEW [lame bastards].

Someone asks for an opinion... give it... and be done. Easy, no?

FyreLance

Is there any security risk using these actuators? IE some toy a clever theif could use that scans frequencies until they find the right one that pops your door open or something?

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

I'm not talking about just Redraif's car...half of you ****** think if its not GM, or didn't come off some GM product, its ****.Her taste is different, so what...its her car, her right, and its won its class in three national events this year! She must be doing something right. Besides, nobody is trying to make you like something you don't like, just not be an a$$ about it. Tact is a skill that will do you some good when you move out of mommy's basement.

As far as $59 wheels, you're really showing your ignorance now. Neiche Wheels are far nicer than wannabee ZR1 rims. She just didn't want to run another boring 5 spoke like everybody else.I could as easily call you ****...you have dime a dozen ZR1 wheels on a car thats not a ZR1.
Grow up. This thread is supposed to be about helping other F-body owners, not berating other people's cars.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Its no riskier than having remote door locks...someone could do that with them, too.

redbird_400

Just hope it never freezes over and you cant pop open your door. Now that would be fun!

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Well said. The main point here that everyone could learn from is that if you don't like something, and the car owner didn't ask for your opinion, don't give it!!! If its a poll, or they want advice, fine, give it...but you don't have to be a jerk about it. IF you have something to add to what is supposed to be a technical thread, add it...but if you don't have anything to add, DON"T POST! Is that so difficult? I could stay busy all day, searching out things I don't like on the cars of people who post...but what is gained by telling someone their car is slow/tasteless/junk/whatever? Nothing. If something burns you up so bad, PM the owner...don't waste the bandwidth here, and get another good thread locked.

redraif

Not to hash this again, but the Judges at the TA Nationals don't agree with you. If it was as ugly and such bad taste, they were not forced to give me a 1st place trophy in the heavy custom class. Every car has enough flaws that if a judge does not like it they can not place it. But all the cars in the class were nice. There were 8 others to be exact. Again some were not what I or others might have done, but none were done badly or were crap.

People like you need to keep your opinions to yourself unless someone asks. No one here asked what you thought about my car, so buzz off. You all time and time again ruin posts with your unsolicited tactless comments. Grow up. People are trying to learn something hear not listen to you whine about what mods you don't like on my car...

And $59.00 wheels, not. More like $400.00 ea. Not what I paid, but that is what the rim retailed for when they originally came out. I got them from a wholesaler. Your need to actually open your eyes more often cause there is nothing remotely like those rims at Pep Boys. Niche Rims are specialty rims. Each style is only made in small quanties for a short time, so as to keep the rims original. That was my purpose in getting them.

FyreLance

Instead, you two have to spend all this time defending RAIF (not saying that's a bad thing, I'd do it too) because of a couple of people who can't keep their "opinions" to themselves.

I was hoping to go to the T/A nats with the main intention of meeting you and Shannon and seeing the car in person, as I live about 10 minutes from where it's held (I live in Huber Heights, it borders Vandalia) but time got away from me and before I knew it I was saying "AAACK! T/A Nats where this weekend and I missed it!". Doh! I've never gone before. Next year though. Next year.

redraif

Thanks for the back up & we will definately see you there next year!

joezero

I'm not worried about it, it rarely ever reaches near freezing temps here. Does anybody else have any ideas about brands of welders, the Lincolns and Millers were a little too high end for me. Thanks, Joe