hollowcd

Well, I really actually want to know if I screwed up. I purchased a beautiful chrome polished superram intake and edelbrock L98 intake manifold setup for my engine build. I actually won it at an auction and I got a little over excited and purchased it before I did all of my homework, always knowing that I could resell it if I needed to. So here are my questions.

1. Does the superram work well with boost, aka 12psi coming from a D1SC blower?

2. My setup will include a motown block, AFR heads, and the pro-charger listed above, roughly making a hopefull 600H, will the superram fit into this package nicely?

3. All of this is going in a 92 RS camaro. I currently have the 305, but I have the TPI off of a Z-28. With the fuel rails that I have on the TPI work with the SR?

4. ECM, which one will I need in order to make this run? Currently I have the 1227730 ECM running the speed density system.


Any help would be greatly appreciated. I know that I have a lot to learn, but I want to do things the right way so I am not afraid to ask. So far I have a 9" Moser built rear end, and this SR that I just purchased. I am working my way up, slowly but surely. Thanks for the help.
hollow

brutalform

Should make a great engine. You can supercharge to your hearts content. Easy to adapt a centrifugal SC to a "front breather" engine, like a S/R, M/R, TPI, and those uhmmmmm... Ford 5.0s.

The rails will fit.

Look into a 749 ECM from a Typhoon or Cyclone, as they are suited to manage boosted applications.

Carefully choose the camshaft, and injectors.

What are the dimensions on your AFR heads, and what cubic inch will this be?

hollowcd

AS for now I am undecided on the rest. Probably 383 or larger, and leaning towards AFR 210's just because of advice, but I am open to anything. Whatever combo will work best for me, thats what I will go with. Having a bulletproof motor is more important than money issues so I am here to learn. Thanks for the replyhollow

brutalform

Yea, a 406, and that thing would be a real beast! Nothing wrong with a 383, but I would go 406.

vernw

iTrader: (2)

You could go with stroking the 350 block to 396, ..or..
something I've been thinking about is Bill Mitchell's Motown short block - which is available as a 427 - and I see you're planning on using one of these. By the time you add up all the components for a forged small block and the associated machine shop charges, $4500 for an expertly assembled bullet proof 427 small block is really not that far out of line IMO.

The 210 AFR heads may be a bit much considering the SC will increase the flow of something like a 195 head, but I'm the first to admit that I am NO EXPERT when it comes to blown applications!

I agree with Tom (brutalform) on using the TPI fuel rails with the SR, that's what you're supposed to use. Works fine on my 383SR setup. And from what I've read the 749 is the most popular ECM to use for boosted applications. Altho I know of guys that have used the 730 for that just fine - one for over 500HP at the rear wheels. Plus there are efforts under way in the Super-AUJP development to include boost provisions in version 5, only problem with that idea is it may be late next year before that is available.

brutalform

Wow, Vern, I totally skipped over the Motown block part in his post. hollowcd, I do not think 600 hp would be any problem at all. Keeping the tires from frying off, however, will be!

Vern, version 5? I'm using S_AUJP_v3 with success. Wow, I have to get out more.

vernw

iTrader: (2)

Yep, Motown blocks are pretty strong and sweet!

Version 4 of S_AUJP is just about to be released (I've been helping test it). Version 5 is still in the thinking stages as I understand it....

hollowcd

First of all I want to say thanks for the replys to my post. I am just getting started with this build, and I want to do everything right. A lot of people would think I am crazy for going this big with my first real build, but when I do something I want to do it right. I am not afraid to as for help and I need a lot of it, so thank you again for all that are willing to help. On to my next questions:
When selecting engine displacement, how is it calculated. I noticed on the motown page it lists the bore, Main Size, and deck height. From the engine calculators that I have seen, they need bore, stroke, and # of cylinders to calculate CI. Is the stroke just determined by the piston rod length selection that I make? What about compression ratio? I know that with running a large amount of boost, I need to build with a low CR probably around 8:1 or 8.5:1. Will there be a definite advantage over one CI size to another? I want the best selection for big power, and low headaches when finding the internals for the build, once again it will all be forged internals. Boy, that 406 does sound nice . Well again I appreciate the help and I hope that I am in the position to return the favors someday. Keep em comin.
hollow

brutalform

Stroke is determined on the size of the crankshaft. The longer the stroke, and the larger the cylinder bore, the larger CI you will have.

If you have a 400 block, you will have a cylinder bore of 4.125, and a stroke of 3.75. Now, if you bore the block .030 over, will now give you a 4.155 cylinder bore, and now you will have a 406 CI. Now add a 4.00 stroke crank to the mix, and you will now have a 434 CI engine.

CR is more involved, as you will need more info, like valve reliefs, compressed head gasket thickness, deck clearance, cubustion chamber volume, etc. to get a CR number.

Grim Reaper

Make sure you investigate whether those AFRs will fit the Motown Block. I recall someone tried to match AFRs to the Motown Block and found they didn't line up properly. I can not recall the bore size or the head size, but I was shocked to hear that there was an alignment problem.

This may have been resolved or not a problem with the new AFR Eliminator heads. But do check it out first.

brutalform

Glenn, IIRC, they were the 190s that had a fit problem. Good point though.

hollowcd, if you run a search on the AFRs with the fitament problem, you can find out what you need to know. I'm almost positive they were the heads with the smaller runners though.

hollowcd

Do you think that these are great heads for my application, or should I look at other brands?

hollowcd

Also, I want this to be a daily driveable, pump gas driven car so make sure that is taken into consideration on suggestions. This is the most important thing for me, next to the HP,

Grim Reaper

The new AFR Eliminators are suppose to flow even better than the original AFRs with Competition Porting. Plus, they may not have the fitment problems.

Talk to these guys http://www.adperformance.com/ 1-877-273-0005.

Ask for Brian and you can mention that Glenn (aka Grim Reaper from Thirdgen.Org) recommended you to talk to them.

ADP should be be able to answer if there is any fitment/leaking issues with the new AFR Eliminators with the World Castings Motown Block. Depending on your needs, they can even create the entire long block for you, possibly with your cam of choice.

Also I think you just may get a better price

hollowcd

.

hollowcd

Sweet, thanks Grim.
hollow

vernw

iTrader: (2)

That looks really great, hollow. Please let us (or me at least) know what you find out on the fitment deal...

doc

A supercharger will work with anything, its all in how you tune it. An SC can blow thru anything, just run a boost thats best suited for the CR.

Engine size: For my stroker motor that I built, I had looked into the Motown block (I was very intrigued about 427 cubes out of a small block.), but in the end was worried about compatability issues between the heads, intakes, that it might sit up higher in the engine mounts etc etc.

Use a GM block (maybe the ZZ4 block) with 4 bolt mains and I must is a forged craankshaft. The rods and pistons must also be up to the task. And get pistons which will get you an appropriate CR.

Firebird90

iTrader: (1)

I was thinking of SC my 418 motor with SR and AFR 195's. But my compression is to high.

Watch your compression when building your motor. If you want to run on pumped fuel.

Good luck on the project

dave-92gta

iTrader: (1)

my dad and i are currently building the motor on my car. i have been told by many many poeple different amounts of comp you can get with pump gas. waht is the most you can get. i dont think i will reach it but i jsut want to know. my mission is sort of different, im using vortec heads and il probably bore my block. i dont want to steal your thread, sorry, i jstu thought since there were some big experts in this thread i will get a good answer, any maybe you had the same question as well.

Firebird90

iTrader: (1)

What is the highest octane in your area?
We have bad gas in Cal. Only 91

brutalform

With EFI, and aluminum heads, you can get away with 11.1. Iron heads, knock it back to 10.1. Like mentioned, you will have to consider the quality of the available pump gas.

I have a CR of 11.2 and run 91, or 92 octane.