New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
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New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
I just finished reading the latest Chey High Performance (May '07) and took interest in the Patriot Performance head write-up on p#74. Patriot is now offering a Freedom Series sbc head, and for the listed price $795.00/pair, they seem to be a good deal.
Has anyone delt with Patriot before? Anyone use their products. From what I understand they made their 'mark' producing LS heads and are relatively new to making the 'old' gen I and II style heads. That said, they seem to have a good reputation with the LS style heads.
Your please.
-Andrew
Has anyone delt with Patriot before? Anyone use their products. From what I understand they made their 'mark' producing LS heads and are relatively new to making the 'old' gen I and II style heads. That said, they seem to have a good reputation with the LS style heads.
Your please.
-Andrew
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They have a web site patriot-performance.com however, there is no info provided about these heads (or atleast I couldn't find any ). I e-mailed them to see what the deal was.....The heads might be new, and perhaps, the website hasn't been updated yet
I would like to know stuff like: manifold bolt pattern availability (vortec or just traditional sbc), accessory bracket mountings, center and or perimeter style valve cover bolt pattern.... etc..
-Andrew
I would like to know stuff like: manifold bolt pattern availability (vortec or just traditional sbc), accessory bracket mountings, center and or perimeter style valve cover bolt pattern.... etc..
-Andrew
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Car: 1987 Pontiac Trans Am GTA
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I actually just bought these heads bare from a company that got some directly from pariot and they got here in like a day. They look good im doing some minor porting and polishing just to clean them up. they are suppose to flow 263 cfm @.600 lift im going to get them flow benched after i get done with them just see for my self. i will let everyone know how it runs with them on it. Later Daniel
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I actually just bought these heads bare from a company that got some directly from pariot and they got here in like a day. They look good im doing some minor porting and polishing just to clean them up. they are suppose to flow 263 cfm @.600 lift im going to get them flow benched after i get done with them just see for my self. i will let everyone know how it runs with them on it. Later Daniel
-Andrew
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Car: 1987 Pontiac Trans Am GTA
Engine: 355 Stealth Ram
Transmission: 700R4 w/ 2600 stall
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt 3.27
well i dont know how thet are yet seeing how i havent put them on but like i said they are a nice piece for the money i can only hope they will work as good as they look. my dad owns a machine shop and i took them there and he looked them over and we lapped the valves and i have alot to work with. he was alos impressed with them. Later Daniel
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Dan
can you tell me what intake bolt pattern your heads are drilled for, how about the valve covers - perimeter or center bolt or both? and also accessory brackets - are the heads drilled to accept them.
Thanks
Andrew
can you tell me what intake bolt pattern your heads are drilled for, how about the valve covers - perimeter or center bolt or both? and also accessory brackets - are the heads drilled to accept them.
Thanks
Andrew
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Car: 1987 Pontiac Trans Am GTA
Engine: 355 Stealth Ram
Transmission: 700R4 w/ 2600 stall
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they are for both normal and vortec and both on valve cover, and also for all accesories. it tells you that if you read about it and just look at the pic in any magazine. i noticed all that before i even got the heads. If you do enough research you could have answered your own questions i dont mean to sound like a **** but it common sense to me.
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Car: 90 Formula -- tot resto in progress
Engine: 350
Transmission: 700R4 w/ 2500 stall, by Owen @ ARD
Axle/Gears: 3.23 posi disc
If you still have the Stealth Ram (in the profile), what
is the configuration of the 2 center bolts? I've seen
the pics, and the non-vortec bolt pattern appears to
be all the same angle. If you have to solve this problem,
with the new heads, I'd appreciate sharing the experience
with us.
is the configuration of the 2 center bolts? I've seen
the pics, and the non-vortec bolt pattern appears to
be all the same angle. If you have to solve this problem,
with the new heads, I'd appreciate sharing the experience
with us.
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i contacted patriot about info and they said they would mail me out some info it will be scanned and posted as soon as i get it.
Last edited by redcamaro83; 03-19-2007 at 08:27 AM.
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Car: 1987 Pontiac Trans Am GTA
Engine: 355 Stealth Ram
Transmission: 700R4 w/ 2600 stall
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt 3.27
the stealth ram intake is set up for both 86' and prior and 87' and newer the only difference is that the 2 center intake bolts are sitting at a different angle. all holley does is elongate the holes. some people have had intake leaks because they dont tighten them down right or something. mine doesnt so i couldnt tell ya. i cant wait to get those heads on so i can spread the word about them i should be somewhere in the 12's or if my porting work is done right hopefully high 11's i guess we will see. if you have any other question feel free to ask. If you still dont get about how the bolts are let me know i will take some pics and post them Later Daniel
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Nope. Elongated holes was the the answer.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
These heads seem like a good head for the money. We went down to their plant in Alabama. They showed us that some stainless steel valves are not too good of stainless steel, but the ones they use are a good grade stainless. You get an assembled set of heads, non ported or polished for 795.00/pair. We got them right before Christmas with $20 shipping, they weigh 50lbs. I thought that was a good price for shipping.
We did a little gasket port matching on the heads and intake. We haven't run them yet, but they seem like they'll be a good head. Great service too!
They haven't updated their website with the new heads, but they are exactly the same as the $1295.00 except they are not ported and polished.
Part#:
2180(angle plug)
2181(straight plug)
Made from Alum. 356-A
23 degree valve angle.
The are 195cc heads would be 188cc-non ported, so i guess the 215cc would be around 208cc and the 225cc would be around 218cc.
The Combustion Chamber is 64cc
Intake 2.02+.100 and Exhaust 1.60+.100
5 angle valve job
You can get single(Max lift .575") or dual spring(Max lift .650" for a little more $)
Viton Valve seals
Pushrod guide plate included
Manganese Bronze Valve guide
Works with both Perimeter and Center Bolt Valve covers.
We did a little gasket port matching on the heads and intake. We haven't run them yet, but they seem like they'll be a good head. Great service too!
They haven't updated their website with the new heads, but they are exactly the same as the $1295.00 except they are not ported and polished.
Part#:
2180(angle plug)
2181(straight plug)
Made from Alum. 356-A
23 degree valve angle.
The are 195cc heads would be 188cc-non ported, so i guess the 215cc would be around 208cc and the 225cc would be around 218cc.
The Combustion Chamber is 64cc
Intake 2.02+.100 and Exhaust 1.60+.100
5 angle valve job
You can get single(Max lift .575") or dual spring(Max lift .650" for a little more $)
Viton Valve seals
Pushrod guide plate included
Manganese Bronze Valve guide
Works with both Perimeter and Center Bolt Valve covers.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Nice great information! thanks for the info. let us know how they run.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
This is what they replied to me when I asked them for flow numbers.
I think I'll pop for a set when I get the money for an engine build. I have them in mind for a destroked 400...
".100" 67.8 / 50.3
I think I'll pop for a set when I get the money for an engine build. I have them in mind for a destroked 400...
".100" 67.8 / 50.3
.200" 132 / 97
.300" 187 / 137
.400" 225 / 165
.500" 250 / 181
.550" 257 / 185
.600" 259 / 190
They can use a carb or vortec intake. The heads will be $795.00 plus shipping.
Thank you,
Gunnar Bowlin
Patriot Performance
888-462-8276
www.Patriot-Performance.com"
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
i think these are what on my motor there not bad
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
thanks for the info.
Last edited by OneManArmy; 04-17-2007 at 11:07 AM.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
these are what i'm buying its a better deal than high lift vortec heads and you don't "have to" change the intake style
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Alabama cylinder heads (manufacturer of patriot heads) is one of the largest and most respected aftermarket cylinder head companies out there. I have bought some heads (no patriots yet) from them and they were top notch. Shipping was fair along with the price (their prices flucuate with the price of metal so you can get a hell of a deal) Im going to be installing the $1295 heads on the 383 Im about to drop into my 82 Z28.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Just recieved the new issue of car craft and they have a whole multipage review of the patriot heads. I just skimmed over it but they seem to like them.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
I have a friend that bought a set and put them on a 355ci motor in his Malibu car runs 12.50s on motor with a 3.20 gear and all steel body with the spray car goes 11.30s (150hp shot.) I was impressed and the heads are streight out of the box no clean up work.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Here is the flow bench numbers from Car Craft for Patriot Freedom 188
2.02/1.6 valve 66cc chamber 188cc intake port
lift ------intake------- exhaust with pipe
.100 -----62--------------- 50
.200 ----123 ---------------81
.300 ......169 .....................125
.400 .......209 ................... 154
.500 ........229.................... 175
.600....... 263..................... 186
2.02/1.6 valve 66cc chamber 188cc intake port
lift ------intake------- exhaust with pipe
.100 -----62--------------- 50
.200 ----123 ---------------81
.300 ......169 .....................125
.400 .......209 ................... 154
.500 ........229.................... 175
.600....... 263..................... 186
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Personally I think the price is outstanding for these heads. I don't really care for the low and mid-lift numbers. I read the CarCraft article. The Vortec heads spanked the Freedom heads up to about 5000 rpm. From there the Patriot heads took over slightly.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
yeah the mid and low rpm numbers ain't great but when price compared to a new vortec tpi base you could get them pocket ported and catch up quick
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
anyone know if they'll work with edelbrock tes headers?
#30
Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
these heads have a 1206 gasket sized intake port. thats very big for a 188-200 cc head.
Its unfortunate too because i have a stealth ram and wanted these heads but my stealth ram is the early model that cant be opened to 1206 ports without adding material to the base
Its unfortunate too because i have a stealth ram and wanted these heads but my stealth ram is the early model that cant be opened to 1206 ports without adding material to the base
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
i have those heads from White performance as well and am happy with them. The 1206 gasket is what comes in the head install kit along with 1003 head gaskets. also note you should plug the intake manifold hoes you aren't using as oil can blow through them when wot and also plug the screw threads on the sides of the head as oil can make its way through the perimeter valve cover bolt holes.UI fiound this out the hard way with a mess of oil that at first i couldn't find then called patriot and they told me what to do.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
thanks for the tip, I'm getting ready to buy a set of these, I was going to purchase from skip white, but if I can get them for $20 shipping that saves me 30 over the 50 dollar shipping price of whites, does anyone have a link for the heads at 20 shipping?
#37
Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
I haven't installed mine yet so am not sure as to which intake holes require sealing as well.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
here is actual flow #'s of there heads with there equipment in them
head specs--freedom series-SBC 225cc hand blended
2.08 intake 1.60 ext 64 cc chambers
I had the heads flowed at hi-tech motor sports in Elk River, MN--one f the best shops in the state look them up
flow data
model-Patriot Cyl tested-#3 date-4-9-11
Test press-28 bore size--4.00 inch Entry Guide- clay
Exit Guide 1 3/4 pipe int valve 2.08 ext valve 1.6
flow #'s corrected Yes Seat angle (i/e) 45 / 45
lift intake exhaust E/I %
0.10 72 55 76
0.20 142 99 70
0.30 208 142 68
0.40 245 175 71
0.50 267 202 76
0.60 378 222 80
0.70 286 231 81
they stated that these heads should be used on a 4.125 bore or larger---
also the flow of the heads is not all that great --the air flow is not smooth through the intake port----flows hard and hits the back then a hard turn
I did some hand porting on a set of 1968 185 heads(on 210 hp 327 motors)
These where some times called single hump camel backs, but are not a camel back head--they are a heavy casting
they where opened up to a valve size of 1.94 intake and 1.6 exhaust and got from 0.30 lift 197 flow to 222 flow at 0.50 and these where also flowed at hi tech the same way as the patriot heads I also achieved 75 % to 82% E/I across the board- not bad for a 1st time port job --there was more material to safely remove if one wanted, but I sold the heads
merry christmass
head specs--freedom series-SBC 225cc hand blended
2.08 intake 1.60 ext 64 cc chambers
I had the heads flowed at hi-tech motor sports in Elk River, MN--one f the best shops in the state look them up
flow data
model-Patriot Cyl tested-#3 date-4-9-11
Test press-28 bore size--4.00 inch Entry Guide- clay
Exit Guide 1 3/4 pipe int valve 2.08 ext valve 1.6
flow #'s corrected Yes Seat angle (i/e) 45 / 45
lift intake exhaust E/I %
0.10 72 55 76
0.20 142 99 70
0.30 208 142 68
0.40 245 175 71
0.50 267 202 76
0.60 378 222 80
0.70 286 231 81
they stated that these heads should be used on a 4.125 bore or larger---
also the flow of the heads is not all that great --the air flow is not smooth through the intake port----flows hard and hits the back then a hard turn
I did some hand porting on a set of 1968 185 heads(on 210 hp 327 motors)
These where some times called single hump camel backs, but are not a camel back head--they are a heavy casting
they where opened up to a valve size of 1.94 intake and 1.6 exhaust and got from 0.30 lift 197 flow to 222 flow at 0.50 and these where also flowed at hi tech the same way as the patriot heads I also achieved 75 % to 82% E/I across the board- not bad for a 1st time port job --there was more material to safely remove if one wanted, but I sold the heads
merry christmass
#39
Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
I made it to the 4th line in your review.
Hi-Wreck SUCKS!
Which I already knew anyway, but just for grins, I looked them up, as you suggested:
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...0-post147.html
Good luck with those heads, I haven't heard bad things about Patriot in a LONG time. But I would not let Hi-Tech change my spark plug wires, let alone build my engine or tune it.
TPIS is one of the premiere names when it comes to SBC's, take your engine there. Either that or DRM, they have lots of happy customers, but I'm not sure if they work with the SBC too much anymore... http://dougrippie.com/
Hi-Wreck SUCKS!
Which I already knew anyway, but just for grins, I looked them up, as you suggested:
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...0-post147.html
F****CK these a hloes, bart and his dipsh***T skinny tuner that dont know how to tune sh***T spent over 1700 dollars on nothing, 95 gt 347 stroker. they royally screwed me and my car. car runs like dog sh**T, wont idle, runs way to rich burns your eyes, these guys are nothing but money hungry in experienced jerk offs, if you cherish your car and your wallet. trust me and the other guys that went through this, STAY AWAY. they wont make it rite with you either, SEE YOU IN COURT A*******HOLES.
After picking up my vehicle I experienced a breakdown requiring dealer service due to lack of care taken by hitech on the install. I also had another system fail that I was able to repair, again due to lack of care on HiTech's part.
They are very slow to take blame and make the customer feel like a penny pincher for requesting that Hi Tech pay for the damages.
If you want it done right - you are still better off doing it yourself.
They are very slow to take blame and make the customer feel like a penny pincher for requesting that Hi Tech pay for the damages.
If you want it done right - you are still better off doing it yourself.
- Pros: They do have a lot of great equipment and some staff are above average
- Cons: Some of the management is as sour or more-so than the worst dealer service advisor on a bad day
Amazing place to get the job done, and done right. This is the only place I am going to take my performance vehicles from now on.
- Pros: You can get almost EVERYTHING done here
have your check book ready!!! they will take you for a ride@@@ they promise alot but have not deliver!!! thr old "stang has found another tuner that will treat her better.
They talk a good game but.. at 125.00 you should get 125.00 of work!! not just a aw it should be good enough attitude.. was there buddy until the check book went empty!
They talk a good game but.. at 125.00 you should get 125.00 of work!! not just a aw it should be good enough attitude.. was there buddy until the check book went empty!
- Pros: talk a good came
- Cons: can not deliver the service
These guys really know what they're doing and have the right equipment on site to make all your horsepower dreams come true.
Good luck with those heads, I haven't heard bad things about Patriot in a LONG time. But I would not let Hi-Tech change my spark plug wires, let alone build my engine or tune it.
TPIS is one of the premiere names when it comes to SBC's, take your engine there. Either that or DRM, they have lots of happy customers, but I'm not sure if they work with the SBC too much anymore... http://dougrippie.com/
Last edited by 88gunmetalgta; 12-25-2011 at 04:49 PM.
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Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
I will not get in a fight about shops with you--so one guy has good luck there another dose not--I am sure that both shops are great and have had good things and bad things said about them--post a pic of your car--just wondering if I have seen it there and the engine-bay
I have had good dealings with them--Bart has been good to me and my wife sorry you did not have such a good experience.........
I am not going to use the heads--I can port my old 461 camel backs and do better up to 0.55 smother flow and better velocity
I have had good dealings with them--Bart has been good to me and my wife sorry you did not have such a good experience.........
I am not going to use the heads--I can port my old 461 camel backs and do better up to 0.55 smother flow and better velocity
Last edited by Rick King; 12-26-2011 at 06:46 AM. Reason: forgot head info
#41
Re: New Freedom Series Heads from Patriot Performance
Nah, my car has never, and will never be in that shop. There's just too many horror stories.
But your right, this thread is about patriot heads...
But your right, this thread is about patriot heads...
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